So Who Doped? Oct 10, 2012

Just about everyone. Does that count as a level playing field? Is professional road cycling tainted for all eternity? Is Lance catching a bum rap? Does anyone really care? These questions and more will be on your mind after poking at this interactive matrix of dopers over at the NY Times.

  • autophile

    Outing people as dopers only seems important in a supposedly untainted sport. ATMO this looks worse for the Tour and the UCI than it does for the riders themselves.

    The people claiming to run a drug-free sport are really just showing their own failure by outing all of the doping in the past.

  • sprint4burritos

    Only legit form of doping is burritos…

  • Sam

    If the matrix were expanded to include the 80′s and 90′s, it would show that the greatest American cyclist of all time, Greg Lemond, did not dope.

    • http://theradavist.com John Watson

      No proof

      • Sam

        Lemond never failed a test.  He’s always been a very vocal opponent of doping in professional cycling. With Armstrong’s massive fraud now fully exposed, Lemond shines as the greatest American professional cyclist we’ve seen to date.

        • German Flea

           Lemond never failed a test? Sounds just like Lance wake the fuck up they were all doing it! If they would be able to test older stuff man I bet they would make Merckx look bad too.

          • Sam

            Lemond never failed because, simply put, Lemond never doped. Unlike Armstrong, Lemond has always spoken out against doping in professional cycling. In fact, that is the main reason why Armstong and Lemond eventually became enemies. Armstrong, who not only doped but also insisted his teammates dope, couldn’t suffer Lemond’s anti-doping gospel. As far as Merckx goes, he tested positive in 1969 at teh Giro and was promptly expelled from the race.  

          • German Flea

             So did Lemond tell you this himself? Fucking everyone speaks out about doping. They all doped, time to move on!

          • Sam

            You assume, incorrectly, that every pro cyclist that ever lived doped. Yes, Lemond has told me, and the rest of the world for that matter, that he never doped. And no, not “everyone speaks about doping” in cycling. Armstrong is, and has always been conspicuously silent on the issue (we now fully understand why). It’s not yet “time to move on”. Injustices must be redressed, and the sport cleaned up (hopefully thoroughly this time around) before pro cycling can move on. The sport may never recover were a future Armstrong to occur. 

          • Micklee180

            Lemond beat guys like Delgado Fignon and Roche who were all doping with epo at the time … wake up he was at it too – analyise his stages during the 1989 tour . Of course he now is totally against doping – Armstrong stole his thunder in the USA and he became jealous – end of !

    • Ultra_Orange

      Dude I thought I heard he doped too?

      • Shorekids

        he doped… just with cocaine rather than EPO

  • http://www.digicycle.net/ Tucker

    dope chart bro!  they selling prints?

    • BaconBeercan

      lol

  • Ultra_Orange

    What is so stupid is the amount of people doping. If you expand that chart to include everyone that starts and you’ll find even more dopers. Then again there was doping for years in hockey and no one cared, then baseball and I’m sure there is no shortage in football. 

  • Manin

    To tell the truth, marshes has never been disqualified for doping
    he was removed from the “Giro D’Italia” in 1999 for a dangerous hematocrit level

    • Manin

      ups, Pantani

  • Anon

    Imagine this.
    Joe has natural hematocrit of 40.
    Bill has natural hematocrit of 37.

    They both take EPO to boost their hematocrit to 50. Joe gets a 25% increase while Bill gets a whopping 35%.

    That shit is as level as your top tube, twat.

    • Danchabanov

       What this guy said. Doping is absolutely not a level playing field.

      • Richard Smith

        Whilst Bill may get a larger hematocrit increase than Joe, surely the fact that they have both been artificially brought up to an identical 50% DOES level the playing field somewhat? Do you want the race winner to be the guy whose physiology happens to be the most suited to the sport of cycling, or do you want it to be the guy who has worked the hardest?
        With that in mind you’ve also got to consider that there’s a myriad of other factors which can’t be artificially levelled. No sport can ever be 100% “fair” per se, unless all of the participants are clones who have been fed the same and are using identical equipment.

        • Guest

          You do have a bit of a misconception in your argument … talking about the winner being the one “who has worked the hardest” or “naturally having the best physiology” is completely different than having a “level playing field” because of doping. It´s about sports, so either training hard or having the right physiology would be fine to me, whereas doping just sucks because you are betraying the real sportsmen …

    • iStone

      EPO all in my veins
      Lately things just don’t seem the same

      Acton’ funny, but I don’t know why

      ‘Scuse me while I pass this guy.

    • http://www.facebook.com/ezweave Matt Weaver

      Yup.

      Hamilton’s book is worth a read too.

  • Busmag

    pantani no!!!!!!!!

  • Solomonsofolawe

    the competitive nature of our fucked up society,is what has created a atmosphere in which humans feel as though they need something to excel at the most absurd of levels. Human ability is not enough, people need something to make them super-human. I don’t blame them,because doing that or having discussions about such things is futile.

    What should be discussed is the absurd competitive nature of our society, which is perpetuated by monetary gain.

  • Josh.H

    Fuck it dude lets go bowling. 

  • Doctor_Jones_

    Funny thing about this story is the USADA is the one pulling his jerseys and titles, but they have no jusidiction to pull them since they weren’t the ones that issued the titles. UCI is the only one who has the right ot pull his titles, so all this publicity has no grounds. No tests have been failed by Armstrong.

    • Dontcoast

      LOLZ!

      better re-read the rules.

  • Dontcoast

    People only care cause Lance is still a bullying liar. The things Lances’ lawyers are saying are hilariously pathetic, such as “USADA hired people who represented big tobacco”. Oh, Livestrong also hired lobbyists with ties to big tobacco, and what does that have to do with anything?

    Not a level playing field, getting what he had coming when he built his house of cards.

    Just man up and come clean Lance, schlummy fans are very forgiving to their superstars.

  • Dontcoast

    I’m kinda surprised at this post, kinda seems like a “well it’s not that bad” fanboy shill post.

    Also, read the “reasoned decision” USADA report. Pretty entertaining stuff, IMO.

    Here’s the link:

    http://www.scribd.com/doc/109697907/USADA-Reasoned-Decision

    Also, so many of the dopers on the graph you cite are associated with people named in the USADA instigation: Landis, Hamilton and Leipheimer introduced to Ferrari by Lance, Contador and Vino worked with Ferrari, etc… more juicy tidbits in the report.

    And it’s Leipheimers second offense so he should maybe also get a lifetime ban…

    …all that being said, take a big rip of something worthwhile and go find some dope hills to climb, and have fun :D

    • http://theradavist.com John Watson

      I dont like Armstrong. How does that make me a “fanboy”? ;-)

      • Dontcoast

         haha just giving you a hard time I know you know the only good dope is fun dope and don’t give a shit bout procycling.

        it’s just the “level playin field” thing is often used by fanboys :D

        this shitshow’s been pretty entertaining though, which is what pro sports are about anyways, right?

    • http://www.facebook.com/ezweave Matt Weaver

      Armstrong’s behavior is different.  He will probably never confess, but the legal bullying and intimidation he has resorted to is pretty bad.  He basically blackmailed everyone into making life hell for Hamilton and, especially, Landis.  He threatened Lemond… that’s what makes him worse (that and the lack of confession).  The stuff about hiring private investigators to harass Hamilton in his book is pretty damning.  Something is wrong with that guy… (Armstrong).

  • Luc

    They should do it like body building, clean and open.
    I want to see the open class TTT ;0

  • Jossdakin

    Lance is still the king.

  • greg Straightedge

    It really says a lot about amerikans and sports when you have to go back to 1990 for an amerikan to truly win The Yellow Jersey.

  • je

    Contador was only doped for the last Tour and Giro he won. Why add 2007 and 09?

  • Dylanbigby

    Lance lost me as a twitter follower

  • Karma

    I just want to watch Pantani cranked up to 62.5% hematocrit CRUSHING people in the Alps. (Ok so I’m being a bit flippant but I do sort of miss the outlandish alpine attacks from that era of the sport. RIP Pantani.) I like the idea of clean sport and perhaps this will all have a lasting impact (?) but really I just want it all to be over.